Tim must be very jealous of my time; he thinks I am very free. However, this is not true; I am still working, travel alot, and still think I need to make that $1000 per month to meet my cost of retirement. I guess more than 90% of members are still working.
Last week, I thought about what I need to do to retire. This coincides with an article I read in TODAY. Have you really thought out how to live your retirement days to the fullest?
In the article, the writer is 61 yrs old. He saw his friends get so bored that they become a nuisance to their spouses and children. Some solved the problem by going back to work. The rest lived aimlessly or waiting to die, very sad.
The writer advised 4 pre-conditions if one wants to enter into full retirement.
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Children are financially independent
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You have zero liabilities.
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Have enough savings to support your lifestyle.
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And importantly, you know what you will be doing during your retirement.
One option which many countries have adopted is to encourage continued working. Singaore is one of them. Personally, I feel very sad because we have already been working the last 30 – 35 years. Can we see more of the world, get to do things we have not done before, move into something different?
I am trying to resist working fulltime. How?
This Post is not just about me. I know many of you are also in a similar boat. Let’s share and think aloud. Make a little effort to share your thoughts.
Terence Seah
Hi T. Seah;
We are in the same boat. When I finally stepped out of my office for the last time as an employee – I made 2 hardline decisions for MYSELF –
1) Not to work under an employer as I had done since I left school donkey years ago
– some reasons being * I do not want to stress again as a slave of labour imprisoned against my own will / bound by working hours. ** I want to retire with DIGNITY which I sometimes gave away when I was working to feed my family – I shall work free-lance / self-employed to supplement my reitirement income.
2) I want to do voluntary work especailly overseas – which I had connected up to be implemented soon – where? currently I wish to keep to myself – I shall let the cat out of the bag after I had done it for at least 30 days – I do not want to label as a NATO man ( No Action Talk Only!)
why overseas – not in S’pore? -I can’t find it here to suit my interest – I need to be happy to give then the results will be greatest – I do not want paan chin pah liang = half kati eight tahils type of giving-it is not my cup of tea !
Hope I did not sound over impressive -but believe me that is how I am feeling now – I had let my children known of my above feelings/intentions – it’s all systems go from them -thanks for their understanding! Hope I had contributed something to your forum – Thanks – have nice days ahead !!!!
Hi Terence!
I’ve handed in my resignation letter since last year. Supposed to terminate this year in April but I con’td because they replied that my connect plan will be forefited.
Thus, my retirement will be end of this year. Well, even I could work another 2 more years, I kept thinking enough is enough. I’m very tired after being in this line for more than 37 yrs!
I’ve no liabilities and my children are independent.
The only setback is that I still have to look after my aged dad, 85yrs who is suffering from dementia.
I’ll join in more of SHC activities and exercise more often.
Travelling to places that I haven’t been or join more church activities.
I’m lucky if I can take up some part-time work if I’m bored.
Of course, there are many a times I’ve mixed feelings if I’m doing the right thing. I’ve pen my thoughts quite some time ago if you remembered and you guys advised me not to retire.
Friends, please do comment if you wish!
Thank You.
Cheers!
If the reason for retirement is because you are tired or bored I can assure you that a few years or even months after your retirement you will feel more tired and bored. It will happened after you have done what you have always want to do – travelling, a well-deserved rest or whatever.
You need to actively occupy yourself or else you will find that you are waiting to go to that square box.
Start a new career – one which interest you and your life will then be full of hope of vigor.
Hi Steven!
Thank you for your comment of that “oblong box”! Ha:)
I think I know what to do after I’m bored again. Luckily, I do have other alternative work to do!
I can always go back as adjunct! I can always give tuition.
Thank You!
hi all,
I am newy retred, from 01Dec2009. It’s about 9 months plus. I am 60 years old coming 61. I guess one have save up, buy insurance, invest…. when one is younger. Then you can see some money. Well,I still hv to look at the stock market. far from being bored, I hv yet to find time to do all that I hv in mind. I have traveled quite a bit, NZ, Swiss, Penang, Chengdu/Juzhaigou and Manila. I read, practise piano, help in church, try to clean the house, go for free concerts, etc….meet up with friends, join SHC..
My two daughters are working, one married. My son is in the poly. My wife is still working
Still paying installments for my flat..
I am not rich but can get by. be content and live day to day. do not worry, be happy
I salute U; Weng Hon -even U have flat instalments to pay + son is schooling -yet U have retired !It is not easy – one has to have a lot of $$$$ to be in your situation.
Lucky U !!!
Hi Fong Fong #1,
Like you, I too think that many of us would want to get out of that structure we have been all these many years. Economics tells us if we have a job, hold on to it. But, then every day after 55 is a day lost in exploring what we have missed and what we have always wanted to do. I wish you well, and do let us know when your overseas idea is set in place. If I were you, I would think I would be pretty excited. I guess you have achieved the 4 points which I have indicated in the post.
Terence Seah
Hi StevenN and those who have made similar observations,
Steven, you have pointed it out. Over many years, we have seen our colleaques in the office or factory. They are vibrant, active and fit. Then, one day they retire. And, before we realise it, they have left us totally, out of this world.
Doesn’t this frighten the shit out of our souls, and prevent us from seeking retirement? Why?
Terence Seah
Hi Terence,
I always hear you asking how to make $1000pm. The way to make $1k pm is NOT to make it every month. You should wait for the opportunity to arise than make a bet. After 1 full cycle, which may be more than 1 year, you can then till up your net earnings and see if they make you the $1k pm.
The difference is under your aim, you will be ‘forced’ to participate/ bet every week or every month, or even every day, when there is basically no advantage to you. You should instead wait for the opportunity to come, then make your bet, ride it through if you feel you are right and cash it through when another advantage comes.
Quite a lot of people like to punt on tips, trading systems etc. If it works for you, fine, just make sure you don’t bet the house on it, keep it ‘small’, say up to 20% or even 30% of your portfolio. Enjoy he experience, whatever the outcome, good or bad, profitable or unprofitable and make sure you have a learnt something from the ‘tip’ or the tipster, the trading system, the stock, the methodology, or whatever it was that initiated the bet. Remember it, store it, it is the beginning of your new found adventure or obsession.
Yes, it can be either. Many people cannot ‘not trade’ after the experience of winning, and of losing. That is not the end. Be objective for the market is an objective and strict disciplinarian. Admit sincerely when you have lost, (not so important), have made a mistake, (very important). Don’t count your profits until you have closed the books, ie when you think the stock/economic cycle has expired. Along the way, if you have made some money, treat yourself (and perhaps others) to SOME of the profits and keep the balance for the time when you will make a mistake and have losses AND for the accumulation of risk capital which is so necessary in any biz venture.
The balance of the portfolio? That is a different topic and question not yet raised.
Cheers
Cat-Ho, you cant be serious to say that looking after yr 885 year old dad is a “set=back” altho it does set you back a bit in $$. The wise Chinese have this to say of the elderly : ???? = ?????
I an freed from the regiments of a 8.30 to 7 job, happy to work flexi hours for an intelligent man and find a lot of time to reflect. Hv now discovered that my life has been flat while the smart feed their wallets to grow fat.
When i am still lucid & sane, I hv told my kid that she shd try to do well in life, dont bother to give 2 hoots to her dydda when he is old and look pathetic & lost. His duty to brining he to this world is to look after her, not the other way round. Least, to burden her. Filail piety is for the ancient world to uphold and it has demised with the passing on of my parents.
The future? Who cares? Osama is likely to find enlightenment under the coconut tree, shave his hair and goatie to repent at the WTC site, preach and do peace………….
And then join SHC.
Hi Terence and Steven Ng,
About retirement, I received from SHC members, an email of a study in USA, made on retirees there. Apparently they surveyed a sample and found that those who retired earlier, say at 50-55 years, lived much longer after retirement, say 20-25 years, than those who worked longer, say up to 65 years, as they live only say, 10-15 years after retiring.
It was an interesting article but which we could not share it here. I think Paul Kong may be the member who sent it to me. Nevertheless it can also be sensitive as some may not want to discuss this topic. I also cannot remember when the survey was made.
But safe to say I agree with S Ng that we have to fill our time even after retirement, which I think SHC has done very well, with the travel companions, cycling, walking and other activities they arrange.
I think, for you, even in your retirement, you have to spend quite some time on your retirement portfolio, especially given the interest in the subject. Some others, I fear have to send even more time, given their unfamiliarity with the subject. They tend then to piggy back on others, which can be dangerous, and which does not solve the problem, which is to understand and make your own decisions. There is unfortunately no short cut.
Cheers
when MM said there should be no retirement age, i felt so sorry for pple who WANT to retire. The way i see it, there are three groups of pple who don’t want to retire:
1) pple who sayang to lose their ‘fat’ pay. They may complain about work stress, but they do NOT want to retire.
2) pple whose identity is defined by their job. Retirement means becoming a nobody and they just cannot accept that.
3)pple who enjoy their job. Their job is their hobby.
But when your job becomes a drudgery or when there are more meaningful things you want to do and your job is taking up all your time, i think to be able to retire is a BLESSING.
my 2-ct worth.
#1 Fong2
Your hush-hush voluntary service project is intriguing! If you need help, do contact me because i believe in helping the needy. :)
Retirement…mmm…I did think seriously about it last year…same reasons as many others who did…getting bored with the job.
But after giving it some more thought, I decide to do something else instead…the world is large…I can experience something else different outside…rekindle that passion in another area.
What will I do when I finally retire? I will buy one lot of share in many blue chip company, go for free budget lunch at their annual / quarterly meeting and ask awkward questions…that will be interesting. Anything else? I am still thinking…welcome any suggestions.
Cheers
Hi Conrad,
That is a very interesting idea and a very good start. Call me when you are going to the meetings. I may join you or see you there next year.
Meantime I would like to ‘share’ with you 3 ‘tips’.
Read the following books if you are serious about this course in your life.
1) “The Zurich Axioms” by Max Gunther.
2) “Trend Analysis” by Martin Pring. (Title may be wrong but not author)
3) Any book on candle stick charting
4) “The Day Money Died” (can’t remember author’s name, have misplaced my copy)
“You will have an adventure”, quote from “Zurich Axioms”.
Good luck and may the Sun always shine on your face.
I want to too but do I dare?
Perhaps not, at least until I dare say “Come what may”. I think I lack the courage to move beyond my familiar and comfort zones.
Many friends have advised from their personal experiences, I shall soon become bored if I retire now. It must indeed be true then. A few more years perhaps, to earn enough to pay for my travels at least.
But then ah, it may not be my choice to make. Someone may decide to give me the boot! Then okay lah, it’s been decided for me.
Shall then ask Charles and Henry again on the books I should read and Tian Soo for organic meals in return for tilling his land.
Er Charles,
Early Retirement at 50-55
50+20 = 70, 55+25 = 80 i.e. 50-55 = 70-80
Later Retirement at 65
65+10 = 75, 65+15 = 80 i.e. 75-80
Both can live up to a max of 80 years leh. In fact, demise at younger age of 70 for early retirement.
Unless you mean being able to “Live It Up” for 20-25 years if one chose early retirement compared to only 10-15 years in later retirement.
Fong, this “Dignity” thing. I seem to experience it more now than I used to. So, am trying to be detached and not claim ownership but stand by my principle to put in my best efforts. If tantrums are still displayed. Let the culprit bear the repercussions himself.
Be happy! I owe it to myself to at least try.
Nite nite.
dAISY
Hi Daisy,
Your Maths is correct of course.
Actually I read the email some months ago and cannot remember the actual figures. But the conclusion is clear. They say that the longer you work, the amnount of remaining years after retirement is much shorter than if you retire early. That is why I asked Paul K if he could supply the email.
Because of the sensitivity of the survey and its conclusion, I wrote the figures, (from memory) to show a less significant and less shocking conclusion. But you got me there.
Anyway the survey was done in USA where one may argue that the demographics, lifestyles, work stress etc are different. Lastly of course, one may argue that these are only statistics, remember, “there are lies, damned lies and stats…”?
Then again one may say the conclusion is obvious without the need for empirical data.
I had a friend who retired early at about 42years. I asked how was it. He said, the first few weeks were very good, getting up late, eating what he wnted etc. Then he started to call his friends to play golf, gofishing etc. After some weeks he did not have enough friends to play golf and go fishing so often with. In fact some of them told him they could not afford the time since they were working.
Then he started to go to the golf courses alone, and go fishing alone. After some weeks he left for USA. Again he was struck by loneliness. After some months he started working for the same company again. I have lost touch with him as he is now stationed in USA but I think he is still working.
I have quite many friends who have not had a paying job for many many years. They are still very happily occupied managing their portfolio. So you might say that is their job.
When I am asked what is my job, my answer is “My job is to take care of my family, which is quite big and relatively young.”
That would include paying all the bills but which is not a priority by choice.
Lest I be misunderstood for inflating, my point simply is we have to lead a balanced life, priorities, health, time, money etc.
Cheers and good night
While it’s good to think 80-85, remember that’s an average. That means half will live beyond and the other half below. When to retire will then depend on each perspective.
If you think you are in the beyond group, then well and fine. Otherwise, time to rethink the retirement timeline. Whatever the timeline the aim is to live life to the fullest within constraints.
So, may the forces be with us.
Cheers
Quote : 3)pple who enjoy their job. Their job is their hobby. ( I’m blessed to belong to this group)
I have few friends in civil service..their job is a drudgery but they hang on for 35yrs till now…
they have no commitments… I told them to retire and do sth else…
what I really cannot understand is.. why are these people so insecured without a mthly paycheck.. they stinge and save all their lives… even wear a watch that’s not working
When out with one..always say she forgotten to bring her ezlink card…and ask me for change for bus..
When I took 1+ years off…everybody thought I cannot get a job or being choosy…they’re more anxious than me
For me I’m like MM Lee..no reitrement for me as I’ve to be doing sth… whether is stockmarket or others…
cheers
Hi ChristinaP #18,
I am just like you; I enjoy my work. But, I am determined not to work all my life; so I want to retire. There are many other crazy things in my life that I have not done so yet.
Unfortunately, I am not one of those guys who believe in working till death. I love to spend more time with my kid and wife before they consider desserting me.
Hi CharlesC #9,
The $1000 a month is a serious objective. I think that is an amount that we need to get around, have a few meals and coffee somewhere a day, buses to take and probably leave enough for some pampering.
Savings cannot last forever. A dollar out is a dollar out; it never comes back. The $1000 helps to keep any savings intact.
For those who have retired, please share with us too.
Terence Seah
FOR ALL SHC MEMBERS –
esp: Terence/Doris/Jassmine
Yes – I had passed the 4 points test as criteria to retire as mentioned by Terence. yes we need $$ to survive – but having worked for so many years – is it not time for us to relax and enjoy whatever years we have balance?? To be able to wake up the next day healthy – is a bonus $$ itself + we only live once!
Our generation has missed out many leisures of life- look at the the crowds at the Suntec city tours roadshows- I dare say more than 80% of the people are still young and they are going places!
For me at their age I was still struggling with 2 jobs to survive!I am not jealous of them – it is that I am not that fortunate!! I need not go further …..( I feel sad)
yes – I promised once I have settled in my new voluntary work – I shall break the news over SHC website for anyone willing to come and enjoy the holiday facilities – yes I am excited /eager to start when the time comes !
Cheers – be happy !!!
There is a time and a season for everything. Read , listen and talk for all you can about the subject but eventually, you decide. You know it when it gets you all the time..take the plunge and RETIRE. To each his own.
Hi Charles W,#21,
I agreed with you totally! “To each his own.”
Thank you for your advice…. take the plunge and RETIRE!
Of which, I’d been contemplating for a couple of yrs ago.
Hi Tim #10,
I said that my only setback is looking after my dad is on the $$$ issue of having to hire a maid to look after him.
My only worries is how long can one’s savings last.
Sometimes, it’s only those who are single care-givers will understand the situation better.
The Chinese proverb is more to encourage younger generation to stay with their in-laws esp for those who can look after their children better than with the domestic helpers. They can also tap on their wisdom.
Cheers!
Hmmmm, interesting .. the four preconditions:
• Children are financially independent.
Yep – got this one. My children are financially independent.
• You have zero liabilities.
Yep – got this one. I have zero liabilities – but – my possessions are humble. For example, I do not own a villa in Bali, nor do I own $5000 branded handbags.
• Have enough savings to support your lifestyle.
Yep. Yep. But – I must clarify that – I have enough savings to support my lifestyle – because my lifestyle is simple. I do not care much for fine dining, nor do I need to zip around in a fancy car.
• And importantly, you know what you will be doing during your retirement.
This one? Mmmm, while I agree that it is important that one knows where one is heading, it is also alright to kick off one’s shoes, and simply let events unfold.
Yes – heck – we have worked for 30-35 years. We tried so hard to balance career with raising a family. We made sure that our children are equipped to succeed in our society. AND, at the same time – we took care of our older folks.
I felt that we ought to have a well-deserved rest.
I decided to get out of the rat race in 2007. I stopped work at 56. Some ppl think that I have strike the jackpot.
No – I didn’t – definitely not. I have worked hard for every single dollar that I have.
In 2007, I felt that enough is enough. I wanted to enjoy the comfort of my family. (I had spent my younger days coming home late from work, exhausted, just to kiss my sleeping children ‘goodnight’.)
Now – I want to enjoy the company of my grownup children. Play with my grandson. Travel a bit. Read a lot. Take quiet walks in the cool breeze. It is cliché, but – heck – at last – I have time to stop and smell the flowers.
What? Work another few more years? Till 60? Till 65?
No. I wanted out then – at 56. And that – was the best decision I have ever made!
Nowadays – If I doze off while reading in the afternoon, it’s ok. I no longer feel guilty about having “wasted my time” and “not doing anything productive”.
Yes – I can do anything I wish to do…
I had taken a “teaching course” just for the sake of interest and knowledge. Then, I toyed with the idea of teaching English, oversea. Then, I thought – why not teach English to the poor, here, in my own country?
Or – perhaps – I can join a volunteer group, to go build a house for the homeless in Africa…. Or –
So many possibilities…
Hi Terence
Thanks for bringing up this interesting topic and here are my two cents worth of sharing. I’ve been working for the past 39 years: 29 years as a full-time secretary and freelancing as a tutor for the past 10 years. It is wonderful not to have to work for any Boss at our age. Referring to the four conditions, I think I’ve passed the test for at least 3 of the conditions, except what am I going to do if I were to retire 100%? I’m happy with my 2nd career now as there’s flexibility, no need to meet the whims and fancies of any Boss, earning just enough pocket $ without over-stressing myself.. and more importantly, keeping myself busy, my mind healthy and at the same time, having the time to ‘smell the roses’ (^_~)
I had no time for myself at all when I was raising the Y generation viz: my two children. It was a mad rush from home – office – home and the cycle repeats itself for almost one and a half decades!
Now, my goal is to make this lap of my life the best in my life. We have to take care of ourselves physically, spiritually, emotionally, mentally and in our relationships.
Physical – taking up aerobics, line dancing, uke jamming, yoga, brisk walking
Spiritual – church and other spiritual reading/activities
Emotional – having dates for lunch, dinner or coffee with family and friends
Mental – freelancing as long as there is a demand for our service.. by and by, perhaps evolving into some voluntary work
Reading, emailing and travelling are some of my favourite things .. All these are on top of the housework which I’ve got to do – never had a maid! haha!
To keep our minds active, we can pursue courses like counselling, psychology, social dancing, hairdressing, learning a language etc etc…
Last, but not least, of course, SHC is a v good platform for making friends and taking part in various interesting activities. Kudos to Terence for initiating this club! Thank you Terence…
Come to think of it, there are so many things which we can do in retirement … may not have enough time! Also just wanna have more FUN AND LAUGHTER in this lap of my life!
Let me end my sharing with a quote:
“TODAY well lived makes every yesterday a dream of happiness and every tomorrow a vision of hope”.
Cheersssss……..
Gabriella
Hi Gabriella and Jacqueline,
Well done, you are someone who has taken the determination and courage to live a new second half of your life. Interesting too, you have effectively met the four criteria.
Keep folowing up on this topic, I am sure your experience will help others take similar steps.
Terence Seah
Hi Cat Ho #2
Since you have asked for comments? Take the plunge to retire if you have met the 4 pre requisites (quite a good yardstick) for retirment. But only you can make this decision for yourself! If you’re bored, I’m sure you can return to MOE as an adjunct teacher or a private tutor … (with no Boss to bother you!).. haha!
Moreover, we can be travelling partners to explore the world? kekeke…………
All the best!
Cheersss to Miao Miao………..
Gabriella
Hi Terence #25
Thank you for your kind words and encouragement!
I’m taking the liberty of making another quote:
“No one has said on their deathbed that they should have spent more time on work!”
kekekee………
Cheers,
Gabriella
ok. I think the message is clear. Retirement could be most fulfilling,not merely days of boredom. Jacqualine and Gabriella had taken the plunge,and spell it all out for us. As long as you fulfill the first 3 requirements, the 4th is only a matter of adjustment to a new way of life. So wait no longer ! Life is fragile and uncertain. Time is running short.
Terence #19 – I am retired so I shall share my experiences.
Sometime in my mid 30s, I decided upon an early retirement to pursue a different lifestyle after 40, “live life to the fullest” while still healthy, so to speak. Didn’t do it when I got there, the money making machinery was too involving. I pushed on for another 10 years or so, then I picked a nice date and did it.
My aims then were to learn new things, try new experiences and spend quality time with people. As previously planned, I left to live abroad, bought and ran businesses for a period, undertook varied work on p/time basis, attended courses, learned skills, enjoyed outdoor activities, traveled, made new friends etc. My retirement years are jolly good ones. On top of that, my health improved . No reason to change any of that except perhaps I should now start to think about doing some voluntary work too.
The 4 pre-requisites mentioned on this post are important bread and butter issues for retirement but one must have the mindset to proceed. One point to remember is that once retired, you can’t ask “did I do the right thing?”. This is because you don’t know “what might have been” in the first place and chances are, you don’t look back anyway. Retirement is a major chapter in our life, We want to decide for Ourselves when would be right.
Despite what is generally believed, I met many people who found peace, fulfillment and meaning in their lives after retirement. Other than the new found freedom and the opportunities presented, I believed that these people have discovered that there are important purposes in their lives beyond their full-time job. I am happy for you if you are in this class of dignified and privileged retirees.
HC
Hi, Terence:
I retired four years and a couple of months ago, at 58. I retired earlier than planned, for health reasons. Although I enjoyed my work and its chellenges, I figured I had better walk out when I still could, and not wait till I have to be carried out.
Of the four conditions mentioned, the first two have been fulfilled. The third condition was okay, so long as I live within my means and barring the unexpected. Most people may have problems with the fourth condition, but I thought I had that covered with a lifelong passion – origami – which I planned to pursue to the fullest on retirement. I get to travel – often by invitation and sponsored – and will have manage a modest income to boot.
Things were working fine for the first two-and-half years, and I thought I was doing okay. Then I had a debilitating stroke. That really threw things askew.
There is not very much one can do with one bum hand and leg, being confined to a wheelchair, dependent on others for the simplest of tasks, and with ever mounting medical bills.
The hard lesson learned is that one has to be prepared for any and all circumstances. It does make sense to continue working as long as you are able, especially if you have not planned to do anything specific with your retirement time.
I do believe that, even if you are financially stable, you will have to remain constantly active in mind and body, to maintain your faculties in good working order.
PS: I am recovering well. Have dumped the wheelchair and walking stick, got back to some mischief and hope resume where I left off quite soon.
Ron Koh
Haha, Ron-K, once you’re let loose on the side of mischief, the world will again be a more fun and funky place. You can then hop on an origami plane and with Jac-H yr co-pi;ot together build houses for the poor, homeless and under-privileged in America……..and while she teaches them English, you make origami toys for them to take home. Wow, count me in, man !
Hope to see more of you both at SHC activities………soon.
I think we all know how to answer the first, second and fourth questions easily. The difficult one is the third question, “Do we have enough savings to support our lifestyle?” By that we can safely assume a simple lifestyle, not a 1st class type, ie we don’t travel 1st class, we travel budget or its equivalent.
How much savings is enough depends on our anticipated returns from our savings. Assume our savings are $200k. Current depo rates will provide us about 0.25% to 5% pa. So we are getting there, slowly.
If we up the risk factor slightly to buying shares but with strong balance sheets, no debt, discount to asset value, we would reach the targetted 6%. Had we done this earlier this year, we would have gone beyond. Does anyone agree so far?
Could we have done this with property, in any country? No because while we may buy a property with a $200k downpayment and have the rental payments pay for the monthly mortagage, our exposure is not the $200k but probably above $800k. Remember we have to keep our liabilities zero as we have no earned income.
Can we do this with any currency? Again no because no currency today yields >6%. In fact had we attempted to do this anytime in 2010, we would have suffered losses if we had chosen A$, NZ$, Euros or even Sterling.
Please remember we are NOT talking about trading, ie no trading of currencies, shares or property. Only parking our money to generate a 6% return. If we are confident we have a trading skill that we can risk $200k or even half of it, $100k, we don’t have to talk about targeting a 6% return
I think the crux of the matter is really how to make our money work for us in a way that has acceptable risks to us, does not require too much daily/constant monitoring, so that we can have the time to pursue our aims/goals/dreams.
Others may have their own methods but essentially it is a modification of 1 of the above 3 asset classes.
The discussion we have not made so far is how to analyse equity risks and how to ring fence them.
What do you think?
How come some paras were lost?
“How much savings is enough depends on our anticipated returns from our savings. Assume our savings are $200k. Current depo rates will provide us about 0.25% to 2% pa. Ie $500 to $4k pa. This is clearly unacceptable.
Currently we can buy Singapore coy bonds paying a coupon of 2+% to 3+%. Singapore bank bonds currently on sale yield about 4+%. So $200k worth pays about $9k pa. If we had bought these bonds earlier this year, (still NOT the worse or the lowest, we would be 4+% to 5+%, ie a payout of $9k to $11k pa. So we are getting there, slowly.”
Hi Ron Koh!
Gd to hear that you are well and hope to see you again at SHC activities!
I’m waiting to learn origami from you.
Retirment means one has a lot more time to look at the world, at issues which set tongues wagging. Let us be amused by some retirees’ talking turkey.
Mat-hug-tail has retired for some years already. In his retirement, he almost singehandedly caused his anointed successsor to fall and kaput.
Perhaps, the fertlity rate in his kampong is also low and he doesnt hv enough grandchildren to hug and bounce on his laps. So he looks for tails to hug. When even that he cant find, he crosses the causeway and goes after peoples’ tails…..which is close to the fart-hole. He seems to relish farts at him and only then he is satiated.
Peekhoo (not sure whether his cheena name is ???must hv thot he cd treat people like cuckoo. No fun if he had also, as its cheerman, pocketed even just a $ of the ST pocketmoney fund, but will leave that to the Polis (Jass-T, see, this is how the polis work…..they must receive a complaint to commence an investigation.
Minimum wage? Dont wager on smthg which may be vogue in western democracies or 3rd world countries where corruption is the rule of the day.
I am in complete agreement with a ST forum writer OTY. The ultimate yardstick for COL cannot be a number but to relentlessly and periodically find out how the poor fare in an expensive society which attracts the high-spending nouvre richie? Many poor citizens with g’pa and g’ma and kids in tow are usually window shoppers, on-lookers wowing at the rich while they hv their fun rides and fine dinings.
Noe least, Minimum Wage shd never never replace subsidies.
Hi Ronald Koh
We have not met before but I have heard about you and your expertise in origami. Hope to meet you one day.
Just wished to say that my comments on #29 would seemed insensitive and inappropriate had I known that you were about to write what you wrote on #30. My apologies for that. I only wanted to put across a simple message, ie Retirement can be a beginning and not necessary the end, contrary to how it has been perceived in some society.
Have a speedy recovery and enjoy your origami.
HC
Dear Terence, I do envy you and others who have the choice to quit working as and when you guys see fit to do so.
Believe it or not I yearn to be gainfully employed. My last job was in Year 2004 and it was not by my choice I had to quit.
Being a grandmother is a joy of course. However, I am not cut out to be a child minder (with the help of a maid or not)for years to come.
Being forced to retire does not equate a life of ‘shaking legs’, going for high teas and shopping till I drop. I can be a homebody and I relish my own company. Nope, not anti-social but rather I cope by filling my hours reading, surfing the Internet and doing housework.
It’s easy for our MM Lee to say everyone should work for as long as they want to. Realistically speaking, 99.99% of corporate employers will always prefer young employees.
Sigh……
Hi Rosalind #37,
A number of us have personal reasons why we need to keep working; I just feel sad that we have to keep working because we would not be able to meet the high retirement expenses, from housing to transportation, medical and other fixed monthly expenses. The insurance companies say so, CPF says so, the hospitals say so.
Growing old families should be encouraged to value and enjoy the second part of their lives. It’s just the beginning. I love Hou Chong’s guts; he found his retirement years jolly good years; and better still, he is heathier and fitter too.
We will never be able to understand another SilverHairs’ decision. To continue working or take the plunge, retirement and enter the new second world.
For those who have decided to jump out of full time employment, let’s give one another moral support.
Terence Seah
Hi, Hou Chong:
I did not find your comments at #29 at all insentive of inappropriate.
I’m sure we will meet up some time.
Ron Koh
Pple who want to retire but are apprehensive, take a look at your situation: if you are –
1. free from financial commitments, esp your home is fully paid up
2. have CPF + minimum sum
3. have normal savings
4 unhappy in your job -esp if suffering from burnout
5. have interests you want to pursue if u have the time…
I say, you can RETIRE!
For employees, retirement is a phase of life. If you are pro-retirement, this phase of life is most liberating and fulfilling. So the sooner you retire, the longer you get to enjoy this fulfilling period of your life. :)
2-cts worth
Terence
It sounds to me that you want to retire but is afraid to take the plunge.
Consider the time we are were born till about 7 years old. We suck milk and run around naked with our wee wee shaking about. It was good time because we are ablivious to emotional suffering and if our parents don’t discipline us, than life is good.
From the age of 8 when we go to school, everyone tell us to work hard or we will become rubbish collectors. Than each term we have to pass our exams or ‘die’. This continues till we are over 20 years old for some of us. Three exams stresses each year, homework almost everyday. When we have fun, they call us irresponsible, useless or it is illegal.
Than we go to work. We look at our bosses and work hard to be bastards like them. Eventually we get old but the bastards are still up there.
All these while we work for the future. If you continue you will have no future because you may fall sick or die.
All this while we work because we ‘have to’ very seldom because we ‘want to’.
If you can afford it, do yourself a favour and do what YOU want to do for yourself.
Remember, Hell is more fun than Heaven, so let your hair down.
I like Jasmine’s idea at #40. I’m at the uncomfortable age where i think it is too early to retire, just sit around and doing nothing, with no income. And yet, nobody is keen to hire me on a full time basis, i only manage to find contract jobs, since retrenched from DBS in Nov 2008.
I really wish I can be like Tian Soo…. perhaps in another 10 years’ time… i will take the plunge to retire. Retirement is out for me now.. at least for the next few years! I don’t know what to do with my time, if not working!
Quote :
Pple who want to retire…..
1. free from financial commitments, esp your home is fully paid up ( not really, those who can use their money to earn higher than the low mortgage rate now…many stocks are giving higher dividends…)
2. have CPF + minimum sum ( not really… impt is monthly cash flow.. eg rental income, investment income..not cpf or cpf life..your cash of $120k in cpf just to earn a mthly $600 payout..to me it is stupid return…and 80% do not live beyond 80yrs old )
3. have normal savings (as point 2…not cash but cash flow)
4 unhappy in your job -esp if suffering from burnout ( I always take 3-6mths to rest instead of quit..impt is do you love what you do; if not…quit and get a job that you love..life is short; do not work for money..work for what you love and money will come)
5. have interests you want to pursue if u have the time…( the main issue is.. can you enjoy with carefree and no worry about whatever..and do you have money to indulge..there are lots of things to do in life e.g traveling, take up a hobby, interest..etc)
I say, you can RETIRE! – (retire if you must and enjoy life)
I work full time for only 15 yrs..freelance for 10yrs since age 38 (work only about 5 days in a month and earn $1-2k/mth; good year up to $3-4k/mth..eratic income depends on project I take to do at home..
and spend the rest of time on stockmarket, watercolor painting..sit at cafe and watch the world pass by..go spa, play badminton, tennis, swimming etc
At age 50 I felt the challenge to go back into corporate world…rested for 1+ yrs and now ready to be back again….nothing is impossible.. not age, qualification…but a passion to make it happen.. I hope I can..ha!ha!
Terence, I agree with Tian Soo #40. You have touched on this subject many times, as if to assure yourself. No advice or comment from me though, ultimately its your choice. Like my sms to you, I really will appreciate if Tian Soo can contact me. My email is nachind@hotmail.com. Understand cannot put in my hp number in this blog. Its about his organic farm.
Sorry Tian Soo, can’t think of any other way to get hold of you.
Ann
Hi SHCians
Many of you are contemplating retirement or are already in semi/full retirement. But alas, yours truly will have to slog for at least the next decade to bring up my two daughters aged seven and three in South Sumatera.
Fortunately, till now it is much comparatively cheaper to survive in Bandar Lampung, say one goes to work, have breakfast, lunch and dinner before going home, it costs 35,000 rupiahs ($5.20) compared to a minimum need of spending $12,$13 over here.
My remittances of alternating monthly at 3million($450plus) and 3.5million($520plus) is sufficient to upkeep my immediate family(wife, two daughters and stepson) mother-in-law, and assisting my wife’s divorced elder sister and two children and my wife’s younger brother, his wife, now expecting a third child, recalling Terence’s comment of “accomodating a van-load of in-laws”.
With God’s grace and a discipline regime, I am confident of my “mission attaining fruitfulness”.
Regards
Abel Tan
Wah Abel,
You are aptly named “Able”. You have my respect and I wish you well.
Hi Abel
You are indeed able.
Now I know why Terence wants to have $1000 per month for retirement. With the money, he can afford 2 sets of families and relatives that you have.
#43 Christina P,
The retirement life i had in mind when i wrote the pre-retirement checklist, is one that is SIMPLE and based on ZERO income.
The retiree lives MODESTLY on his savings (+pocket money from children?), + CPF annuity payout that will last for about 20 years. When the annuity payout ends, the retiree would be about 80 years old. If he is still living and needs to look for fresh money – activate plan B: make use of his home to generate some income…
…meanwhile the retiree gets to enjoy the trade-off from retiring i.e. freedom from job bondage. :)
NB. The retirement lifestyle based on a modest nest-egg assumes the retiree is relatively healthy and can use his medisave to pay for common, age-related afflictions.
Assuming I were to give a rating on the retirement outlook of different individuals. And, assuming we use a scale of 0 – 10 (where 1 is very modest living and 10 is very agreesive, a lifestle similar to the days of full time employment).
Jassmine #48, you are contented, perhaps you have planned well for your retirement and reasonably talented to activate plan B, I would give you a 4.
TerenceS, if I were to grade your retirement thoughts from afar, I would probably give you a 6. Not so modest a lifestyle, probably with a few options in mind, and of course, thinking that $1000 per month is enough to keep over-expenditure at bay.
ChristinaP, from the few occasions I met you, I would give you a high 9. You have a positive mind, agressive, smart and you take charge of your life. Looks like you have started retirement planning since a young age.
Tian Soo, you do have the best of many worlds. I see you dont let retirement bother you; infact I think you go along with retirement, enjoy what you have. You are well prepared for retirement; but at the same time, i sense you are also pretty agressive in wanting your second life to be just like your first half. Rating wise, I would give you a 8, on your retirement outlook.
Abel, if fulltime retirement is an option, I think you would go for it. But, as you explained, you would continue working into the future. I too sense you have a positive outlook on retirement, enjoy every second of it, while working hard through your SilverHairs years. A 9 for you.
Fong2, looks like you have just entered retirement, or rather a new second life. Can sense your “no venture, no gain” outlook. I think many SilverHairs would like to go along your footsteps. Yes, can see from your expression that you are bold, thoughtful and ready. Retirement outlook 6.
CatH #2, as always a practical lady. Same with your retirement outlook. Bold at stepping into retirement, and yet with possible options at hand. No fear, retirement outlook 5.
StevenN, sometimes I see that for you, retirement is far away from your mind. Yet, you are able to manage your second life well. Defintely someone with a positive outlook, agressive too, a focused young man, and silently agreesive in your plans. Hope you can share your vision someday. I would give you a 8.5.
Weng Hon, for someone who has just retired, you are pretty cool guy and contented. You do show that you are the learning type, a characteristic you will carry through your retirement years. You are defintely ready for retirement. I would give your outlook at 6.
CharlesC, I think you are more than ready to advise on active retirement. While you exhibit contentment in your SilverHairs years, I see you as someone who has full charge of your time, money and life. Like others, I would have to learn from you your retirement vision. Rating 7.
Hou Chong, I would also give you a 9. You too have a positive outlook on retirement. Unlikely will you just sit put. Yuor brain will always crank and your legs are always walking. I too shall learn from you.
It’s probably not fair of me to give the above ratings, as everybody has a different outlook. Situatins are different too. I hope more SHCians will share their outlook on their retirement and plans. It helps us with understanding one another better.
Terence Seah
An extract of an article which I just received thru the email – timely or what????
Longevity Vs. Retirement Age
============================
The pension funds in many large corporations (eg. Boeing, Lockheed Martin, AT&T, Lucent Technologies, etc.) have been “Over Funded” because many “late retirees” who keep-on working into their old age and retire late after the age of 65 tend to die within two years after their retirements. Table below shows Actuarial Study of life span vs. age at retirement :
Age at Retirement / Average Age At Death
49.9 / 86
51.2 / 85.3
52.5 / 84.6
53.8 / 83.9
55.1 / 83.2
56.4 / 82.5
57.2 / 81.4
58.3 / 80
59.2 / 78.5
60.1 / 76.8
61 / 74.5
62.1 / 71.8
63.1 / 69.3
64.1 / 67.9
65.2 / 66.8
The Table indicates that for people retired at the age of 50, their average life span is 86; whereas for people retired at the age of 65, their average life span is only 66.8. Conclusion from this study is that for every year one works beyond age 55, one loses 2 years of life span on average.
The hard-working late retirees probably put too much stress on their aging body-and-mind such that they are so stressed out to develop various health problems. With such long-term stress-induced health problems, they die within two years after they retire.
On the other hand, people who take early retirements tend to live long and well into their 80s and beyond. These earlier retirees probably are either wealthier or more able to plan and manage their various aspects of their life, health and career well such that they can afford to retire early and comfortably. These early retirees are not really idling after their early retirements. They still continue doing some work on part-time basis at a more leisure pace so that they do not get too stressed out. Furthermore, they have the luxury to pick and chose the types of work of real interest to them so that they can enjoy and love doing that “fun” work at a more leisurely pace.
Japanese people retire at the age of 60 or earlier. This may be one of the factors contributing to the long average life span of Japanese people.
Changing Trend of US Pension Plans
==================================
The traditional pension plans of many major US companies used to place a lot of value on the long-term older employees by increasing the pension money rapidly. On the other hand, the early retirees incur very heavy penalty in pension and in other associated retiree benefits – eg. employer paid medical insurance, employer paid life insurance, death benefits for family, etc. However, in recent years, many large US corporations are switching from this traditional mind set.
For me, I would rather not live that long if I can’t affort a comfortable life style after retirement. Least of all, to be a financial burden to my daughter. Think I’ll retire at 65……if I live that long.
Hi Lily Ho,
Thanks. That seems to be the article I may have read before but it shows the same thing, ie you have more years left if you retire early than if you retire later.
I think to put the focus on retirement, the main objection/obstruction to retirement is finance. Everybody knows well what they would like to do if they had sufficient funds. There are many stories of lottery winners who retire after getting the payout. Others continue to work but they know better than anyone else, they can tell their bosses to ‘drop dead’ at the drop of a hat. ‘Drop dead’ money equates to retirement money.
Others like Jassmine’s example shows their confidence in their savings sufficiency because of their savings or the confidence they have in their children’s assistance. Actually your example does not assume a ‘zero income’ like you say. There is income, being returns from savings, some input from children and an annuity on the house.
You don’t need to learn how to live ‘life’ when you retire. It comes naturally, some faster than others. Retirement means freedom from job bondage. The retiree can live and do nothing, live like a pig, eat like a pig and sleep like a pig, and etc. Or he can volunteer, ie work for no wages. He is free to spend his time, golfing, fishing, looking after kids, whatever, but he must feel financially unshackled. And he spends his freedom according to the time his fiances last. If he loses all his money to Madoff, Lehman etc, he needs to go back to work, from being a volunteer to a paid staff.
So I think we don’t have to discuss if our children are grown up, rather we know if they can take care of themselves. Some children don’t grow up even when they are 45 years old. Others can take care of themselves from 18.
My point is simply if we work our money better, we will probably have sufficient retirement money. The key is return on retirement funds. Some people work on the mistaken notion that risk free returns are the only alternative. It’s like saying retirees better stay at home to prevent being involved in an accident
Anybody read the STimes article on fx trading today? They claim most lose and have warned the public not to be taken in by these so-called FX trading gurus who charge 2k to 4k for a ‘fail-safe’ trading system. They should read about the Polytechnic grad, now SMU student who made $400k between 2008 and now. He now has a financial training coy, no debt, a East Coast condo that he rents for $8kpm and a healthy equity portfolio. And he is still studying!!
Hi Terence #49
i think i should get a 10 in my retirement outlook since i’m so optimistic about retirement life and think even on a modest nest-egg, one CAN afford to retire. tio bo?
Ron Koh #39
Thanks for your note.
Terence #49
“…shall learn from you”
Before I retired, I counted my money again and again, hoping to find more through a mistake or double counting. No chance in my case unfortunately, that was all. If you (or anyone else) needed any assistance in counting money, do let me know. I can go through a pre-retirement counting exercise with you to give you an idea whether you can shake legs as a 2nd career.
Lily #50
Mmm, so that is how long our life is…easier to know how many $/cents we can afford to spend for each year now, haha.
Certainly ideal if one were to be able to find a 2nd career in a line of work which one has an interest in and to do it at one’s leisurely pace. I met someone recently, doing p/time work in food/pastry tasting. That sounds like a reasonably good choice of work I think.
HC
Terence, my take is IF one is healthy and still able to be gainfully employed, why retire early? There is a strong sense of self-achievement if one can be paid in exchange for expertise/talent/skills by companies and/or corporations.
Until and unless one is unable to cope with the stresses of working life, retirement will then be very attractive. I feel that if one works, one should ENJOY the job. Being productive and contributing to the success of the company one works for is to me, akin to job satisfaction.
I agree with you that we should not be plodding day in day out year after year with no time for personal pursuits and family. However, if we are willing to accept less pay and work flexi hours, we still can have time to do what we want.
Terence, I am positively sure your company will retain your services on a part-time basis and happily pay you the 1k you need every month. You must be worth much more for sure!
:p
Cheers
Ros
thanks Terence, your score of me at 6 seems ok. To me, retirement is freedom of choice. Doing things at yr own time. If your job allows U to do that, than why retire.? For eg. Terence seems to be enjoying that,,,, can go for chit chats at 4 pm… etc. ha ha
One should not spend the whole day watching TV, sleeping doing nothing.
To me knowledge is important,so we must continue to seek it, but don’t try to be perfect before you take action. It will never happen. DO and try, experiment… don’t be Nato..no acton. …but only learning.
As in the newspapers, even the ‘gurus’ who offer ‘guaranteed’ courses cannot help all. Some will succeed, others won’t. So, ‘think’ and help yrself
thks Terence for your score of me at 9
I never plan… spent all my money in travelling, car when I was working full-time …my motto : travel while you still able..old you can’t hike mountain or walk that much
Then went to take my 1st degree at age 48 and came out “top student”… not that I’m smart but nowadays geting straight As is easy esp. after 20 yrs of field experience
Actually it’s simple to plan… just buy 1 hse and collect perpetual rental…this is safer than punt or invest in stockmarket
Punting or investing in stockmarket is just my side hobby/income
I recommended “Goucoleisure” today runs like crazy..now 68.5cts; SGX now $7.40; sembmarine still hibernating in slow mode…waiting for….
Hmmm…..HC,
Might take you up on the pre-retirement counting exercise. Thanks in advance. Haha…. wish you hadn’t offered right?
Aiyah, all this talk on retirement is really depressing me….. really.!!
I set beside a 90 year old man at a dinner function yesterday. He told me he took a couple of public buses to the dinner by himself. He ate everything that was served and more than me. His voice was strong and his mind clear and of course he had more life stories to tell. I was keen to find out how he can live till 90 and still so healthy and independent.
He is a widower. He had 3 wives and 7 children. His children look after him financially now.
Further enquiries from others at the function, I gathered that he had a few businesses and they were all run by his wives. So he practically retired 2 years after he married his first wife.They work and he enjoy. He outlived all his wives and still have spark in his eye when he look at the young waitresses yesterday.
That is a guy who benefited from early retirement. Is there a lesson to learn from him?
you cut your coat according to your cloth …same for retirement life. If there is a life-long income stream/financial independence, count your blessings. :)
My positive retirement outlook, even on a modest nest-egg, is targeted generally at an ordinary white-collar worker who is unhappy with his job and wishes to retire, but dares not make the move – afraid money may run out…difficulty getting a job with similar salary as current job…. afraid time may hang heavy if not working…
My implicit advice – better think seriously about retiring (use checklist),esp. if health is not so good.
#51 Charles C,
There are many pple who do not have enough “financial intelligence” to invest smartly and some pple are not interested anymore about “making money work harder” in the Autumn/winter of their life. From choice, they want to unclutter their life…simplify…tie up loose ends…pay back to society…work at achieving peace of mind/serenity …because they are conscious of their mortality…
…so if a retiree wants a higher standard of retirement living, of course the nest egg must be bigger.
2-ct worth
Hi Terence at message #49,
Thank you for giving me 8.5 . Retirement is a word not found in my dictionary. As long my finger can move and I am mentally healthy I will do what I am doing for the last eight years – internet marketing/selling and not forgetting stock investment and speculation (once in a while).
This is one type of ‘work’ which can be done anywhere/anyplace and I do explore the possibilities of relocating myself to another country two years back. Unfortunately my mother is inflicted with dementia about 18 months ago and I have to shelf my plan temporarily. I am ‘tasked’ to look after her as I am only one amongst my siblings who is not ‘working’.
By the way, Terence you already have an asset which MAY help to bring passive income in years to come – silverhairclub . Revamp to make it more users friendly and one fine day the ministry of community development + information could knock on your doors to explore the usage of the club to connect to the silver haired. :)
I wanted to stop working…..but then
At age 25 – My mother-in-law has repeatedly asking me to stop working so that I will be at home to serve her and her son…hehehe. Luckily I did not accede to her request and chose to work to avoid conflict with her at home.
At age 35 – My son after his PSLE, told me that he wanted to go JC and then overseas study. Not sure what‘s in his mind, so I better start saving for his FUTURE and therefore I continue to work.
At age 45 – My savings for my son’s University education was not utilized as he has been awarded a scholarship to study overseas. As such I used this money to invest in Condo and collect rental. I am very brave to commit in purchasing the Condo even though the world economy was not favorable then, so I better work……just in case….
Just as when I am enjoying what I have $$$, thought I can retire….my son decided to stop working and wanted to pursue further for his MBA double degree in Paris. Now I have to go back and slog for another 2 more years….sigh :(
At age 55 – That’s when my son finishes his study and probably I can get my CPF….I will seriously consider retiring for real…..wish me good luck….hehehe. I am looking forward to that day. :)
Ah Nee
Actually for those who are loaded and worried what to do after retirement… one option is to purse further study in field of interest… it is not daunting as you thought but can be challenging to mind.. I wish I would…eg the international MBA study that bring you places
Also for those who think that most employers favor young… it depends on task… why not look for task that the young cannot do… and also consider overseas eg China The term and salary are too good to resist, really
I seemed to always being hunted for messy, difficult task that others cannot handle/cope… just got an offer by HK co…for China again
Never think it is too late, too old, over the hill… working is good, retiring is good too It all depends on you
For me I love to work/travel lifestyle that bring me places
Singapore is too unchallenging for me… let the young handle
Hi Jassmine @#59
Bravo! Bravo! Bravo! Well said!
You are that “little voice of sanity”!
Especially, this paragraph:
Quote:
There are many pple who do not have enough “financial intelligence” to invest smartly and some pple are not interested anymore about “making money work harder” in the Autumn/winter of their life. From choice, they want to unclutter their life…simplify…tie up loose ends…pay back to society…work at achieving peace of mind/serenity …because they are conscious of their mortality…
Unquote.
Jassmine – you are such a perceptive young lady.
Indeed, I also agree with your comment @ #52, you ought to get a 10. You are most positive in your retirement outlook.
Tio! Tio! Tio!
Terrence
One thing that I learnt is that yr pre-condition 4 is very important; think that’s why I failed my 1st attempt at retirement. But this is probably the least of your concerns.
Am not sure why you have a $1000pm target. Is this just for incidentals or also living expenses? Anyway, I digress. I believe that it is possible to buy an annuity policy that pays $1000pm. You may want to consider this if you dont want to use Charles ‘averaging’ method.
Weng Hon #55
I agree with you absolutely. The way to go is to continue learning and positively try out whatever you found potentially workable. Within SHC, I can see that there is already groups of people with an interest in investments –stocks, forex, indices, futures, options etc. This can be a good base to start a regular group to bound off ideas from one another. Look forward to talking to you on this subject again.
Incidentally, I am learning too. Put thro my first trade of SnP 500 indices at 6pm today. A trade which after 3 hrs showed a P/L of USD+20. I thought it was USD200. Miscounted 1 digit, turned out to be USD+19.90. Haha…a positive through humble start.
Lily #57
You are able to pick up what I wrote as something real – am impressed.
Yes, I will go through the pre-retirement counting methodology with you soon. In return, will you teach me how to dance with 2 feet, not 3?. Then you can count your steps twds retirement while I can dance happily in my retirement. Sounds good?.
Tian Soo #58
My friend and I also took public transport 2 wks ago. He is a shadow of his macho past. Like your acquaintance, his eyes also sparkled when he saw this beautiful lady seated in the MRT. On that occasion, he made his way to the lady, stood in front of her and gave her a warm smile. She got up then and said “Uncle you have my seat lah”. Is he Fortunate or Unfortunate ?. I have only one advice for him : “Time to retire”.
Steven Ng #60
I have an inkling the policies makers and the media people are watching us too because this subject involved the masses. So far, Members have brought up a diversity of opinions. No one has judged another and we respect all opinions, leave each to consider what is best in the context of their personal background , beliefs and attitude. Where we come across outrageous ideas, they amused and we loved them.
Ah Nee #65
I choose comment #65 to ask you how you see yourself at 65yo, nannying or dancing f/time and working p/time? Btw, I picked 2-2-2002 as the day to retire. I thought it is a date which is easy to remember should I have difficulties with my memory one day.
HC
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Aiyo HC…..
At age 65 – I haven’t think of it yet lah…..still a very long way to go. But for sure I won’t want to work and looking after grand children??? Most likely I will do what I enjoy most….like calling up my buddies KLKK….drink coffee…..cycling…..travelling….free & eazy lah….hehehe ;)
Ah Nee
Hi SHCians
Firstly Charles, apology to you and Paul Kong as I am just unable to find time to organise with both of you, for another road-convoy trip to Malaysia. Perhaps next year.
A further few words on retirment – have a peer-friend, quite altruistic, who since his retirement end’07, spends more than half of his time voluteering his services in a church, orphanage, library and CC. Perhaps he is “driven” due to his wife’s immobility after sufferring a stroke five years ago.
With due respect, my take is nearly all of Silverhairs are monetararily comfortable and therefore, attending two parties plus one short(two-four days) travelling period in every fortnight should be a “breeze”.
Regards
Abel Tan
Hi Jacqueline #63
TQ for response. Was concerned ‘little voice’ might be ‘crying in the wilderness’! lol
Think you’re also a 10 :)
Hi Tim @66m
Am surprised you advocate doing good deeds in retirement. Thought you would encourage more visits to Gayland! lol.
Hi Abel,
Noted. Yes maybe next year.
Rdgs.,
Paul
Jassmine @ 59,
“you cut your coat according to your cloth …same for retirement life. If there is a life-long income stream/financial independence, count your blessings. ”
“…and some people are not interested anymore about “making money work harder” in the Autumn/winter of their life.”
The example to illustrate my point shows a 20 times multiple on interest earnings, from the same bank in Singapore. And you are telling me and the others that its just the way we ‘cut our cloth..’ and that ‘some people are not interested..’
Taking your sartorial example, iamagine 2 seamstress’ working for the same employer, and one is paid 20 times more for doing the same job, at the same time, in the same building, and your considered opinion is they are not interested in the difference. Do you really believe that? That people here, perhaps, upon retiring, are clinically comatosed?
If you publish your poems and 1 agent pays you 20 times what the other pays you, for the same book, at the same time and you can shrug it off as ‘just accept that you have to wear your coat as you cut it?’
Why don’t you do an experiment and organise a lunch, charge the members $10 and another identical lunch for $200. No uproar?
#65, Hou Chong, to get group discussion going on a regular basis is very difficult, I think we had a few before, somehow it didn’t last. Terence is a good leader in this area. Hold on to your S & P 500. Historically Indexes always goes up with time. Henry Yip will Probably agree. I also recently bought STI ETF at S2.98, now it has gone up to $3.13.
I have just close my USA account ( Interactive Brokers) I had a hard time transfering my money back. First time that’s why. So, at the moment I can’t trade US stocks etc.. until I get a broker with a local office and low fees.
Hou Chong @ 65,
Tell you my personal experience just yesterday,
Just finished lunch and when I got thru the door, saw this ‘younger’ lady. Both of us looked at each other and seem to recognise each other but could not remember when or where. I was quite glad when she said, “you look familiar but I can’t remember …”. “Me too” I replied.
Then she said, “Do you know my dad..?”
Was I deflated? You bet I was.
Must remember the good advice dished out, “Time to retire”
Abel @ 68,
No apologies necessary. Many more opportunities to get together again. Many places to explore still. Stay healthy and in good cheer.
Jass-T,
Happy that you do read Chinese and so not much of a banana.
In Gayland or Geylang, you find a lot of strayed wandering bananas. If they’re not helped in time, they’ll become goreng pisangs. Ugly and with peeling flakes. So, my charity on full retirement will begin with reining in the Geylang bananas.
Pls help me. Show and let rhem feel papayas. Convince them that the touch of the hand is supreme, that bananas can be put aside. Kept away from sight.
I will make them gather at a corner and you teach them how to, first, appreciate and then write odes and poems. That’s what we can do together on retirement.
I had a glance at the sky and can see that the moon is getting rounder. My 3 dogs are all ready to howl at the chime of 12.
Are you ready too?
Heheee…………..
Charles #71
What i mean…
“cut your coat according to your cloth” = spend according to the size of your nest-egg. The cloth (nest-egg) is not a fixed quantity, so if you want to spend more, you have to increase your nest egg.
Some pple are not interested ANYMORE in “making their money work harder” (financial adviser’s lingo)because they have other priorities in their silver/golden years. This says implicitly they are confident they will not exhaust their nest-egg.
Banks pay very small interests on savings, including fixed deposits….so what? There are many pple i know who still leave ALL their savings there. Of course you can say they don’t have much financial intelligence. They don’t, and it doesn’t bother them.
They don’t worry about economic outlooks, nor state of the global economy…ponzi schemes… Madoff.. Lehman Bros..fingers get burnt…
…they read about the victims and sympathize ..
Hi every SHCian,
Just wanna share my experience with you since I am a Retiree and have chosen to continue working part-time.
I retired some 6 years ago and went into free lance consultancy service for 2 years. Then an org offered me the same job in their institution. I accepted, dictated my hours (5 hrs per day) mon-fri and am very happy with what I am doing.Can’t ask for more. Or, am I easily satisfied. Hahaha.
I work among young people and they keep me young.I feel that (for me) Age is No Barrier to being able to work among them but of course I do tire out faster than before.
I too believe that one has to have a passion for what one does then it would be a joy to continue working past the official retirement age. I try to maintain a simple lifestyle.
My 2 cents worth.
Geok Suan
#75 TimL
I’ll leave you alone to be the Mother T of Gayland. :)
A quickie b4 rushing out for a meeting.
Steven-N wants to net eggs. Others like Jass-T see not a net but a nest of eggs.
I’d just add and remind of what Deng said, black eggs white eggs, ostrich eggs, dog eggs, so long it’s eggs, go get them. Yes, even salyed eggs – they are still suitable for mooncakes, bak chang.
Finally the 15th has come. Dont forget to howl at the moon 2nite………eggs might drop from there.
Hi Jassmine $59 and Jacqueline #63,
Sorry, if I miscommunicated a low rating on the scale of 1-10 as being low in retirement confidence. In fact, you are far more contented with your SilverHairs years than most. For you, you still have options to work.
Probably, you have calculated well your options and being trifty, you quickly pick up the confidence to retire early.
When SHC was formed in later 2005, the club had a monthly gathering during which members contributed their idea as to what is financially enough for them each month. I remembered the amount ranged from $800 to $4,000 per month. Those who aimed for the $4,000 were clearly confident and insist that they cannot downgrade their lifestyle. They want their cars, their maids, the country clubs, eating out and travel. However, those who indicated that $800 – $1000 per month was sufficient to live through retirement, were clearly relaxed, smiling and glowing in their faces.
From the above meeting, I gather that for many of us who have still not retired, we tend to over-estimate our self-sufficency, over-rely on savings, CPF and property. We then make the decision to retire. But little did we realise that a $1 out is a dollar out. It wont come back. Then, there is the accidental incidentals which have not been taken into consideration.
This explains why I am always focused on that $1000 per month earnings during retirement. It’s an amount I think we have to earn, over an above our retirement calculations.
Thank you everybody for your contribution to this Post. It was a good share. I look forward to organising an event where we meet just to talk about retirement. Do feel free to start a new topic of interest to retirement lifestyle, etc, etc.
Terence Seah
Hi Jassmine $59 and Jacqueline #63,
Sorry, if I miscommunicated a low rating on the scale of 1-10 as being low in retirement confidence. In fact, you are far more contented with your SilverHairs years than most. For you, you still have options to work.
Probably, you have calculated well your options and being trifty, you quickly pick up the confidence to retire early.
When SHC was formed in later 2005, the club had a monthly gathering during which members contributed their idea as to what is financially enough for them each month. I remembered the amount ranged from $800 to $4,000 per month. Those who aimed for the $4,000 were clearly confident and insist that they cannot downgrade their lifestyle. They want their cars, their maids, the country clubs, eating out and travel. However, those who indicated that $800 – $1000 per month was sufficuient to live through retirement, were clearly relaxed, smiling and glowing in their faces.
From the above meeting, I gather that for many of us who have still not retired, we tend to over-estimate our self-sufficency, over-rely on savings, CPF and property. We then make the decision to retire. But little did we realise that a $1 out is a dollar out. It wont come back. Then, there is the accidental incidentals which have not been taken into consideration.
This explains why I am always focused on that $1000 per month earnings during retirement. It’s an amount I think we have to earn, over an above our retirement calculations.
Thank you everybody for your contribution to this Post. It was a good share. I look forward to organising an event where we meet just to talk about retirement.
Terence Seah
Retirement to me means one stop to make effort to earn money. Those who work for others stops reporting to the boss, those who are self employed cease to operate their business. There are also a marginal group who stop reporting to bosses but continue with business ventures but not for profit.
Terence grading of 1 -10, measures the amount one expects to spent when retired. That by itself has nothing to do with retirement. Only if it is linked to efforts to earn the money then it becomes a measure of the degree of retirement i.e. 1 = totally retired and 10 = not really retired.
Many people stop working for bosses but starts his/her own business or spend same amount of time seeking money at home or elsewhere. They may enjoy or suffer the same stress. Is this retirement of simply a change of job?
Hi Terence #81
I see a $59 next to my name. R u dishing out $$$? LOL!
Re. your retirement min. income – You’ll have no problem achieving the $1000/month target in retirement. :) Look at your situation: You have an annuity that pays $700 – $800/m. Rent out one of your rooms …you’ll exceed your target!
Alternatively, withdraw $300/m from your savings (surely there comes a time when one STARTS to withdraw from the retirement nest-egg … otherwise someone else is going to benefit from it, right?)…
.. just ensure u have no debts when you retire.
2-ct worth.
I guess everybody has a different idea of what retirement is. For me, I have retired from my job in SIA which I have worked for 39 years. In fact, I took the early retirement package offered by the company. No more black mondays and office politics and bosses chasing for datelines.
But,though retired, one still hsve to do something…So, I am doing some onlne trading of Singapore stocks. I don’t feel stress and only spend some flexible time on it. I travel quite a bit and have other hobbies, jogging, chores and errants to do. So much better than working for others. flexy time also. 1 cent worth of advice.
We see the passing of another great, probably the greatest of all who have left us since independence.
Suddenly, accolades start pouring in as if so many many know her. One guy is thinking of not celebrating his birthday this Wed bcos it coincides with her funeral. Another perhaps wanted to be counted as the first to call at her wake. Nevertheless, she was rewarded with an interview.
“??????????????”
Oooops, it went off too fast.
“?“ was left out.
Nobody so far seems to note that it takes a very good man – to steer clear of temptations when he becomes the most powerful man, and his everything before him. He remains the doting, loving 1-woman man and sees so much beauty in her……a beauty that has increased with passing time.
This man has earned my admiration and respect. I can only wish him well but know it isnt easy. Not when he has lost a mate so close, intimate and dear, and a pillar of strength and a beacon of light to him.
All the more he shd not retire even tho it’s burning and carrying on with the candle alone now………..